Saturday 22 October 2011

Chivalry, Is It Dead & Does Anyone Even Care Anyway?

Some things in life make me cross. Generally being around 'the public' is one of them. (I'm not really a people person). But some things make me more cross than others-today for instance (you knew that was coming didn't you?). I was sat on a train, minding my own business, when it began to slow down to pull into my station. I put my hand on the pole to indicate (so I thought) that I wanted to stand up. All of a sudden the aisle next to me filled with blokes, all pushing and shoving. One of them nearly hit me in the face with his holdall. By this time we had pulled into the station, and I actually couldn't stand up because there was someone so close to my face, and I had no wish to scrape it along some strangers bum just in order to get off the train. It's not like I had masses of stuff (one fairly small ruck sack and a carrier bag), but I just couldn't get out of my seat. And you know something? Not one of the blokes jostling me waited for me to get out before they pushed past me. In the end I just shoved my way past the next person in line, muttering angrily under my breath.
So I ask the question, is Chivalry actually dead?
Now I know my feminist friends are probably going to be reading this in horror thinking "But Jenni, you're an independent modern woman! Why should you want men to wait for you?", and don't get me wrong-I hate the way men objectify and lust over women along with the rest of you. I think far too many men have far too little respect for women as a whole, and it's something that really does need to change.  But I actually find it quite nice when men show a little bit of courtesy towards me. In fairness, I would have been just as cross if it had been women stampeding past me on the train too, so I guess all I wanted was for someone to be polite enough to offer me the chance to get out before them, rather than shoving my shoulder out of the way as if I wasn't there.
But ladies, let me put this to you, as I am genuinely interested in your answers. Say you were walking along a corridor with a man you knew, a friend, a colleague, a boyfriend etc, and he stepped ahead of you to open the door for you and allow you to go through first. Would you feel pleased that he thought of you, or would you feel patronised that he felt the need to help you out? I personally have never felt offended when this happens to me, I see it as more of a compliment really. I don't think he's saying "You are woman, woman cannot open door", but more enjoy the pleasure of having someone do something nice for me. I have never objected if my boyfriend offers to carry one of my bags for me, or when he walks on the outside next to the road so I don't get hit by a runaway carriage. It makes me feel good, coz it's like he is looking after me. I don't understand why people take so much offence to it, personally.


But let me know what you think!
Is Chivalry dead, and if it is do you miss it/think it should come back?

Jenni

6 comments:

  1. I don't think that your argument is for chivalry so much as common courtesy, to be honest. You're right that men are generally the least courteous, though, I think.

    Also, the battle to get on/off trains/find seats on them is the kind of hell which is second only to getting on/off Ryan Air flights...

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  2. Well in fairness...It's kinda hard to get men to fight for you when someone insults your honour nowadays...but I dunno-pulling out chairs and letting ladies go first seem like modern equivalents. Chivalrous enough for me ;)

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  3. If you're genuinely interested, then I'll make use of this account before I've even drafted a single blog post XD

    I agree with Amy in that common courtesy is much more important than chivalry, which I find full of assumptions and privilege, and is another facet of the gender binary system that, in my opinion, should be entirely broken down. Someone who went out of their way to open a door for me would make me feel awkward and indebted, and I would see someone who actually pulled a chair out from under a table for me as being rude for getting in my way when I'm trying to sit down. If this was a friend, I'd feel that said friend didn't know me as well as they should do, and if it was a stranger, I'd feel that they were making creepy efforts to get into my pants. A person should hold a door open for another person because they happen to be walking ahead and don't want to see another person get hit by a closing door. They should let a person go through a doorway first only if that person got there first. Pulling out chairs for other people is still inexcusably rude. Personally, I think that anyone who attempts to treat me any differently because they've seen signifiers that imply that most of my reproductive organs are on the inside is seeing me only as a set of stereotypes and assumptions about a group, and furthermore one that I don't wholly identify with, rather than as an individual human that they have no connection to, and who could therefore potentially be as far from that assumption as it's possible to be.

    Basically, if a person wants to have favours done for them for whatever reason they think entitles them to it, they shouldn't expect it from strangers, while people who think they're entitled to randomly hand out favours should wait to find out if the person they're giving them to actually wants them first. People should accomodate their friends' wishes and whims not because said friend fits a certain demographic, but that's how that individual has asked to be treated by people that they know.

    In summary, I would quite happily throw chivalry off its horse and impale it to death on its own lance. Then I'd get people to actually think about who they're interacting with and start treating people like people.

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  4. Expecting common courtesy from other people because you are a fellow human being in need = fine and dandy.

    Expecting special favours from men because you are a woman = not okay, in my book.

    Expecting men to go out of their way for women just because that's what men are supposed to do for women is all about gender roles rather than manners. I used to work with a man who, if we were walking down the same corridor, would bound ahead to reach the door first to open it for me. If he'd naturally reached the door first, fine, but he would go out of his way to get there first, and that, to me, was demeaning. If he'd let me open the next door to return the favour it wouldn't have bothered me, but he wouldn't let me because I was the woman and he was the man.

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  5. I JUST TYPED OUT A MASSIVE LONG COMMENT AND THEN LOST IT COZ OF THE STUPID UNI OF SHEFFIELD EMAIL SERVICE. CROSS.

    The gist of it was:
    -Perhaps I want courtesy from people rather than chivalry. I hate the general public an awful lot, and don't know if it's due to my low tolerance of idiots or them actually being irritating.
    -I can agree that "bounding ahead" to open a door for someone/not letting you open it yourself would be seriously overly annoying. Like stabthemintheneck annoying. That is taking it too far.
    -I have grown up always being moved to the inside of the pavement by my Dad, and now a) do it automatically and b) don't really like walking next to the road. Thankfully Nate has never objected to me always swapping to be on the inside.
    -Some part of me likes the whole "protector" role of boyfriend. I like to know I am being looked after I think.
    -I then went on to say something about jousting that probably didn't make much sense. Because it's 5am.

    NIGHT!

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  6. To expand on your second thoughts about courtesy vs chivalry -

    "Some part of me likes the whole "protector" role of boyfriend. I like to know I am being looked after I think."

    That, of course, is a perfectly valid desire and something you're entitled to, feminist or not. But that is a facet of your relationship - something that is a part of your "indoors" socialising, rather than something that (general)you should necessarily project onto "outdoors" social patterns. To be looked after a bit is part of the agreement you make with your boyfriend; that's how you like him to treat you and that's how he's happy to treat you, as an (unspoken?)interpersonal contract of action. Men protecting women shouldn't be taken for granted because all men don't know all women, and don't know how protected or unprotected they like to be.

    Consent is key.

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